Full Episode Transcript

Episode 8:  I Can’t Be the Only One Who’s Going Through This (with Jared)

Transcribed by: Kisa Nishimoto, Eryn Strong, Hannah Rosentreter, Gina Marioni and Sonia Montejano

Running time: 76:27

Jared: On top of this pandemic world, and getting engaged, and telling them the weekend before, and now he’s in a hospital, which we still don’t know what it is at this point, he throws this loop in where it pulls in this other aspect of my identity into this story. And, I’m just at a loss and I have no idea what to do.

[theme music fades in]

Jodi-Ann (as host): Welcome to Black Cancer. I’m your host, Jodi-Ann. As you heard from a clip at the top, today’s episode involves multiple narratives layered on top of each other: an unprecedented public health crisis, an unexpected cancer diagnosis, and Jared’s father’s unwelcomed reaction to his engagement announcement to his longtime partner, Ryan. 

There are a lot of questions that just don’t have answers, and how to make sense of it all. And that’s because this is Jared’s life – now, in real time. Oftentimes, survivors and the survived talk about cancer in the present tense, because its impacts are always with us. But Jared’s story is happening now. His father’s battle with brain cancer is happening now. These unanswered questions at the time of this recording, remain unanswered now. So why share it? Because we know there are a lot of people out there whose cancer journeys are just beginning and unfolding now. We want you to know that you are not alone. And spoiler alert, this conversation does involve pop tarts. Here’s my conversation with Jared. 

[theme music fades out]

Jodi-Ann: Before we get started, I just want to set some context here. So, you and I have been talking here and there about your story throughout the summer, and what’s been going on with your dad. So if you told someone that you were going to open up about this story on a podcast, what about that do you think would surprise them?

Jared: Yeah, I think what would really surprise, even just telling someone that I was going to do a podcast, would be slightly shocking, in a way. But I think it would be a good balance of kind of surprise that I would talk about something that’s very personal. But at the same time, generally interested to see it, understand, and hear. And even to understand the types of feelings that come along with talking about it as well.

Jodi-Ann: So do you think people who know you really well, would themselves also be surprised? Because, I mean, you and I know each other [Jared: Mmhmm.] and you shared with me that you’re not super open about a lot of things? And then to like a cancer story about your family… [Jared: Yeah.] How do you think they would respond to that?

Jared: You know, you’re absolutely right, that I do keep things a little private. And I would say, folks, or my friends that I’ve talked to, and opened up about my dad’s cancer journey, I think they would maybe be a little bit shocked. But would probably look at it in the perspective that this is a good thing to talk about it publicly. So that I’m also acknowledging it as well, too. Because I know that I can be a little bit of a guarded person with who I let in and what I share.

Jodi-Ann: And so when we think about you, and in the impact that this could have on you, you know, what do you hope for yourself [Jared: Mmhmm.] in the process of the sharing of this story?

Jared: Mmhmm. I think with this process, what I’m hoping to get out of it is just feeling very comfortable with where I’m currently at, given the current state of the world. And the journey that I’m going through with my family and my dad. And just feeling that I can have a space to talk about it, because I don’t really talk about it all that much. And maybe I’ll feel being strong, we’re talking about very vulnerable things or how I perceive them to be vulnerable. I guess I’m also looking for maybe even like making connections with other people that are in this space as well, too. I was thinking about that earlier today, where I was thinking, Who is this going to reach and what would I want to get out of it? Who can I actually talk to you that’s been through this before, and if they’re currently going through it right now?. And I would want them to know, and something that I would also like, is making those connections as well, too. And just talking about it together and checking in. I think some of the strongest relationships that we make, sometimes come out of very unexpected things in our lives. And they create these, such big bonds. And so, just searching for our community as well, like, just searching for human connection as well, from this podcast.

Jodi-Ann: Yeah, no, I respect that. It’s in some sense of how I even started this podcast of wanting to create something that I wish I had. [Jared: Mmhmm.] And you are, in some sense, creating the thing that you want right now. And so to even bear witness to this, or be a part of that in any way, particularly as your friend means a lot to me. [Jared: Mmhmm.] So thank you, I like, [Jared: You’re welcome.] Thank you so much, Jared, for being here. [Jared: I love it. *chuckles* I appreciate you.] I really appreciate that. I appreciate you. Um, and yeah, like, seriously, thank you for doing this. So, [Jared: Of course.] it wasn’t really until now where I personally learned a lot about your family through our connections and talking about this. And you and I have known each other for some time now. And it’s been important for me. And to just be a part a little bit closer to you like a little part of your life right now. And so, I would love to dive into your family. And so, you know, tell us a little bit about your family, where you’re from, how would you characterize your-your closeness [Jared: Yeah. *chuckles*] with your parents and your siblings? And-and really, how has it changed since you moved out here to Seattle?

Jared: I grew up in Northwest Ohio, in a suburb, but I would consider it the rural suburbs, known as good ole Fremont, Ohio. So if any of you history junkies know what president has a house there, you get bonus points today. *both chuckle*

Jodi-Ann: What president has a house there?

Jared: Rutherford B. Hayes.

Jodi-Ann: I didn’t even know there was a Ruther-fur.. B. Hayes president. *both laugh* So I double fail.

Jared: Yep. So there is a home and museum in this small town of like 17,000 people, very random. So I grew up in Fremont, Ohio, not too far from Toledo, from a family of five. So I have two sisters, an older sister and a younger sister. And then of course, my parents. And my parents have been together for 30+ years. My older sister and I are two years apart. And then my youngest sister is three years younger than me. So, I am the lovely middle child with middle child syndrome. So shout out to other middle *laughs* children. [Jodi-Ann: Kay. Shout out to all the middle children.] Oh my gosh, they get – Can I say it? They get shat on so hard. [Jodi-Ann: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.] 

But sorry that we can tell the truth. So anyway, my sisters and I, I would say are relatively close. But I think as we’ve gotten older, we all have gotten closer. So I would say we’re very family centered, or focused family. [Jodi-Ann: Mmhmm.] Those are very odd way of putting it. [Jodi-Ann laughs] But family has always been an important aspect of my life. And I am also close with my parents, as well, too. And, when I did move out to Seattle two years ago, I think it was a little bit of a shock for my, particularly my parents, it’s been easier for me to tell any sort of, like, big life event to my youngest sister, first. We kind of have like a very special connection where we understand what’s going on inside each other’s heads. And I usually go to her first, then my older sister, I’ll tell them at the same time. And then I usually go through them before I tell my actual parents [Jodi-Ann: Mmhmm.] just to kind of gauge like how they’re going to respond. But I do think that in some capacity, my parents were a little bit sad to hear that I was moving away. And well they’re big Michigan fans and I was living in Ann Arbor, Michigan, working for the University of Michigan, go Blue for any of you Michigan fans out there.

Jodi-Ann: Yes, I went there, but not like a fan-fan. So people say blue, “Go Blue” to me. And I’m just like, I don’t do that shit. *both laugh*

Jared: I love it. Well, I didn’t even go to school there. I’ll just say it but I’m like, Nope. I’m a Boiler fan. But okay. [Jodi-Ann: Uh-huh. *chuckles*] So they really enjoyed coming up and visiting me there. And I think they were a little bit kind of taken aback that I would be moving literally across the country and they wouldn’t be able to see me as often. And in their own weird way, moving or leading up to the move, they never really said that they were like excited or happy for me or for me, or for me and my partner, that we were moving across the country. You know, I mean, they’re your parents, like I’m sure all parents are sad in some capacity when their child moves away. Deep down like, they’re my parents, their my family, of course, they’re gonna miss me. And they’re going to say things that they wish I was home or back in the Midwest, Midwest…Midwest [said in a deep voice impersonating a Midwest accent]. [Jodi-Ann chuckles] I don’t have an accent. I don’t even know why it came out that way. *chuckles* But of course, you know [Jodi-Ann: Mmhmm.] and especially now, I would say, we talk once a week, if not even more. [Jodi-Ann: Yeah.] given the current state of my dad’s diagnosis and the pandemic, but yeah.

Jodi-Ann: Yeah, it’s so-it’s so interesting. So, like, my immediate family is, across three countries. *laughs*

Jared: Oh, wow. I remember you telling me that. So many time zones. 

Jodi-Ann: I have a sister in Korea and a brother in Canada, and my other siblings and my parents are in different states, than I am. And then my extended family, I think we’re across maybe eight countries? [Jared: Wow.] Just like, really all over the world. So it’s only during COVID, when suddenly, we’re just like, “You know what we all have? The internet.” *both laugh*

Jared: Like, you didn’t have that before?

Jodi-Ann: Yeah, but it’s  like – exactly. [Jared laughs] Like, so we’ve had all these huge family Zoom calls. Like, we’ll – they’ll be like 60 people on a call. Or, even my immediate family will do more calls. And so, it’s-it just feels interesting that like, during COVID-19, during this social distance, even though, you know, at least, you know, being out here separate from our families, that hasn’t changed the distance from our families, but it feels more distant. And so, I feel like we’re doing more things to be closer, even though the need to be closer is just a mental thing, right? Like, I still live in Seattle. [Jared: Mmhmm, yeah.] Like it doesn’t change us physically, but now we talk more. But, you know, you mentioned your father’s diagnosis. And so, I mean, I can only imagine, not only are those conversations more frequent, but they could be different in nature as well. [Jared: Mmhmm.] 

And so, you know, thinking about the COVID-19 pandemic, and all the racial uprisings that have been happening, and it’s an election year… It’s like, every other week, there’s some other major thing that’s happening. And it’s just been…just a really trying year for a lot of people. [Jared: Mmhmm.] There’s like a handful of people that are just like “Hell, yeah, like, this is great. I’m about to build 10 more houses.” [Jared laughs] But for the greater majority [Jared: Not me. *laughs*] Yeah. 

For the greater majority of us, we’re suffering. *both laugh* So, even though we’re all taking in tough news about the state of the world [Jared: Mmhmm.] you specifically, during this really shitty time, received especially tough news. Could you share, you know, how you first learned about what happened to your dad, when he was at that Lowe’s, up until his diagnosis. 

Jared: That happened literally in the middle of the pandemic, as it was kind of in its height. Happened in the first weekend in May. And so I found out through my sisters of what was going on, and why does Lowe’s come into play? Like, shouldn’t we be quarantining?

Jodi-Ann: *chuckles* Why are you at Lowe’s, Dad? [Jared laughs] Like, what is going on? 

Jared: I mean, it was – That did cross my mind, I’m not gonna lie. Anyway, there were some signs before that though. Where we didn’t know that they were signs, but they were definitely there. My dad had been going to the grocery stores by himself at times. And there was on two separate occasions where he fell.

I think it was usually my little sister that would text me like, “Guess what happened to Dad today…” Or she would call me and we would talk about it, and she’s like “Well, Dad fell in the store.” And we just kind of talked about, like, “Oh, it’s dad.” Like, “he hasn’t really been active lately.” And we didn’t really think anything of it. Well then it happened again. And so then we’re a little bit kind of confused. Like, Why is Dad just like randomly falling while he’s at the grocery store by himself? And one point, my sisters did have to go and pick him up from Walmart. 

And so, when we heard about that, we just kind of thought, That’s really weird. Not really sure why my Dad’s falling in the middle of the grocery store. It’s kind of concerning. I know he had been seeing the doctor to see what potentially it could be. And then, the weekend – the first weekend of May rolls around. Honestly, it’s even been such a blur to remember how I actually got the message just because of the year that it’s been, and having to recall it. But I believe I received it either in a text message or a phone call. Where my sisters had called me saying, “Dad had fallen in Lowe’s. He is currently on the way to an emergency room. We will be – we’ll keep you updated.” So, I hear that thinking, Okay, that’s a little concerning. You know what, it’s probably nothing. You know, this is the third time it’s happened. This is probably a good thing that we’re trying to find out what might be going on. At this point, we’re kind of talking throughout the day. 

I do remember this day very vividly because I was attempting for the first time making *chuckles* homemade Pop Tarts, and was like, so excited about it because I loved Pop Tarts as a child. And so like, I’m like, talking to my sisters throughout the day, trying to like, start this dang Pop Tart recipe that I found online. Then it gets to the point where they end up calling me again saying that my dad’s being life flighted to Toledo. My sisters’ voices were kind of shaky, and hearing that really made me nervous, especially being in Seattle, where I can’t just drive over the Michigan border into Toledo, because Ann Arbor’s not far from Toledo at all.

Then that’s when they’d said, “You know, he went to the emergency room, the doctor there, found a mass on his brain. And they didn’t like what they were seeing. So they said that he should be life flighted to Toledo.” And at this time, I had not talked to my mom at all. I was getting all of my communication for my sisters. And so I thought that was a little bit odd at first, but then I had to remember, This is my mom, this is my dad’s wife, I’m sure she’s going through a lot. This is the person that she loves, and has been with over for 30 years. So I’m 2,000 plus miles away. And she’s probably on her own agenda of what she needs to do. [Jodi-Ann: Yeah.] So my sisters were keeping me in the loop. 

And so my mom was trying to get her items together. And she was going to be driving up to Toledo, to meet my dad at the hospital. When they, when he went in for further, I believe an MRI –  I think it was an MRI in Toledo – that’s when they discovered that the mass was the size of a grapefruit. And when you hear that, and how big – I should really actually say like how small the inside of our heads are – [Jodi-Ann: Oh yeah.] And how small our brains are like, when you hear that, like, that’s a lot of space. Hearing that news was a little bit shocking, of like, How is there this massive mass, that’s the size of a grapefruit in my dad’s head? 

And then I finally get a hold of my mom, it had been most of the day that I hadn’t heard from her. And so we were talking for a little bit. And I had asked like, “How are things going?” Because this is the first time that I was able to talk to her like, way, many hours later into the day, where she said that she had gotten a call and she was driving to Lowe’s to go see my dad. And he actually actually might have messaged her, the details are still so fuzzy. [Jodi-Ann: Mmhmm.] And when she arrived, there was an ambulance up in the front. My mom was thinking, Surely that cannot be for John. So she walks in and sure enough, she sees my dad on a stretcher. And that’s when the paramedic that was with him was checking his vitals and she had believed that my dad had somewhat of a stroke. And she was like, “I really do think that he needs to go to the emergency room.” So I’m sure my mom seeing that is like, What in the world is going on? 

And so, fast forward, everything starts, kind of piecing together from what my sisters told me leading up to now I’m on the phone call with my mom. So hearing all of that, I think kind of put it into perspective, like, why she hadn’t reached out to me. And I did kind of feel like, Is my mom forgetting about me? But then I sorta remember like, she had so much on her plate. We also come from a big family on my mom’s side. So she has, she’s one of seven siblings. So there’s a total of eight, so she’s having to keep her sisters in the loop. All of my aunts and uncles are now all over the country in different time zones, and then having to communicate that to my dad’s father, my grandfather, as well. So she’s got a lot on her plate, having to get things ready and then driving about 45 plus minutes to Toledo. [Jodi-Ann: Yeah.] So I just remember hearing that on that day, still kind of feeling confused. But at that point, we didn’t know that there was a diagnosis yet. And when they got the results from the MRI, the doctor had told my mom that they believed that it was benign, [Jodi-Ann: Yeah.] that it was going to be fine. They didn’t think that it was cancerous. So, that kind or felt or provided some relief, right? And then as I’m on the phone with my mom, and I’d been asking her, “Well, how was Dad doing? I haven’t heard from him yet. Like can I, am I allowed to talk to him? I don’t know if I can talk to him?” And she’s like, “No, you can talk to Dad. I was just talking to him.” And not even like five seconds later, my dad’s calling me, this is where the point of this story really takes a big turn. 

So, I got on the phone with my dad. I’m feeling a little bit worried. I know that he is as well too and I’m asking him, like, “How are you doing? Like, I’m really concerned. Where are you at?” And so he’s like, bringing me up to speed. He’s like, “I’m doing fine. I’m at the hospital room alone.” Remember, because we’re in the middle of a pandemic. [Jodi-Ann: Yep.] I’m still questioning like, Why were you even at Lowe’s in the first place, but maybe it was a blessing in disguise. 

Jodi-Ann: Like, why the hell were you at Lowe’s? [Jared: Right?] But thank God you were at fucking Lowe’s! *both laughing*

Jared: Exactly, exactly. Because like, what if he wasn’t at Lowe’s and just kind of at home? [Jodi-Ann: Yeah.] How would have this panned out? Right? I think in Ohio, it starts to get a little bit warmer around that time of year, and I’m pretty sure from what my sisters were telling me as he was getting ready to like, put in the AC units so he was there to get supplies. Again, it was still the very early portion of May. So I was like, “Again, Dad. Why were you at Lowe’s by yourself? And two: in the middle of the pandemic.”

Anyway, that’s a story for another time. [Jodi-Ann: Yes. *laughs*] And a discovery/mystery that I still need to figure out as well, too. So then, as we are on the phone call, not even a few minutes go by and the, the tone of the conversation, and the direction of this conversation turned really fast. And it honestly took me by surprise. 

So the weekend prior, I had been on a phone call with my parents. I had called them on Snapchat, because they don’t have iPhones. So that’s how we in air quotes “FaceTime” each other is through Snapchat. And that’s actually the mode of communication of how my family actually communicates is via Snapchat. *chuckles*

Jodi-Ann: Like, the fact that your parents are on Snapchat is just wild to me, because I, me, Jodi-Ann, [Jared: laughs] thirty-something years old, I have never even downloaded the app, but your parents are using functionalities. That’s hilarious.

Jared: Oh, my gosh, that’s like the only thing that they’ve done to like, really push them into the 21st century, like they still don’t have iPhones. So, texting with them gets a little annoying, because I hate seeing green. [Jodi-Ann: chuckles] I want to see blue and white messages. So such a dumb and petty problem. *laughs* So we do a lot of our communicating through Snapchat. [Jodi-Ann: Okay. *chuckles*]

And so I was on a video call with my parents, just kind of talking with them seeing how they were doing. But that was the phone call where I had told my parents that I had recently become engaged to my partner, Ryan, and which is really exciting, right? [Jodi-Ann: Woop Woop!] Thank you. So we had gotten engaged in March, towards the end of March, just days before my birthday. We ended up getting engaged that weekend. And I had taken some time to kind of keep that information to myself. And I only really shared that with close friends. Even you, you were one of the first people to know that we were engaged. [Jodi-Ann: Yay!]

And I just kind of had this thought of like, I don’t know if I’m ready to tell my parents. And so later on that same call. I-before we ended up hanging up I told them, “I have some exciting news.” And that’s when I told him that we were engaged and all of my fears of how my parents would respond – and I thought about this even when I wasn’t seeing anyone, that How would my parents react with this type of news? –  and there was no response. And the camera was on my dad, I couldn’t see my mom and my dad just kept looking forward at the TV and didn’t even turn. Not a bat of an eye, no blink, nothing. No response from my parents. 

And so at that point, I’m like, Whaaaat are they gonna say? And so then, my mom finally says, When did that happen? And I told her that three weeks had passed, and it was three weeks ago, and she said, “Oh, okay.” Then there was some silence and nothing else happened. So, me being me, I quickly changed the conversation like nothing had happened and they continued the conversation like nothing had happened either. And to me, that was a response. And it really sucked to be quite honest. And my heart kind of dropped. Because, you know, I’d been out for seven years, I had been dating my partner for five years. What was gonna? *laughs* What was gonna happen? I don’t?

Jodi-Ann: Like, what did you think girl, [Jared: *laughs*] like, I was gonna marry this dude.

Jared: We’re just gonna play like the gay version of Barbie and Ken in this like, little dollhouse and that’s it. But we actually never get married. I don’t really know. So, like five minutes passed, I ended the conversation and just kind of left it at that.

Jodi-Ann: So this was your day? [Jared: Yes.] Okay. Pop Tarts. [Jared: Yes.] Pop Tarts, that is a crucial element to this whole story, right?

Jared: That’s what I woke up thinking that I was going to do on that day.

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. Today was the Pop Tart day. Your dad goes to Lowe’s by himself in the middle of a pandemic. He falls. He ends up in the emergency room because your mom’s a G and was like, “Yeah, we need to check this out.” And there’s a mass the size of a grapefruit inside of his head. [Jared: Yeah.] And then in all the chaos and navigating information from your sisters, to your mom, and you finally get to talk to your dad. And then you drop the news that you’ve been engaged for three weeks. And that is met with silence [Jared: Mmhmm.] and deflection. [Jared: Yes.] And that was one day?

Jared: The engagement piece of when I told my parents was exactly seven days on a Saturday before this. While everything else Pop Pop Tart day, life flights, EMT, phone calls, all that happens in a single day.

Jodi-Ann: Wow. Okay, so before we get into kind of the follow on to this incredible news of you being engaged [Jared: Mmhmm.] The like, here’s how normal conversations go. 

“Hey, I’m engaged.”

“Oh my god! Congratulations!” 

Jared: Woohoo. Pop the champagne, little poppers. Right?

Jodi-Ann: That, yeah. And that is not what happened. So [Jared: No.] that is a whole story that I definitely want to unpack. But I want to think about this particular Pop Tart day, which led to the grapefruits. Like Pop Tart and grapefruits will be together in this story. [Jared: *laughs* New Pop Tart flavor?] I know, exactly. *both laugh* Listen, you gotta keep that intellectual property.

Jared: Actually, I would be into it because I’m a big grapefruit lover. I love grapefruit.

Jodi-Ann: Citrus pop tarts. 

Jared: That probably wouldn’t taste good. *laughs*

Jodi-Ann: But listen, I want, I want this for you. I hope, I hope there’s some money out there for you with that. So you know what’s interesting? Like, as you’re talking about your mom, she’s kind of falling into her instincts. I think there are only a couple of times in our lives where we see our parents for the other types of relationships that they have. [Jared: Mmhmm.] Like, this is your mother, who on this day was a wife, was a sister, was all these other things to other people. And sometimes you forget what, like, I remember I was in the hospital. And two of my uncles who I don’t think I’ve talked to in like 15 years, [Jared: Mmhmm.] but my dad’s brothers – and my family’s not that close on my dad’s side – but two of my uncles came to the hospital. And I was like, Why are you here? I was, it was just so odd to see them. [Jared: Mmhmm.] It’s not like I see them at graduations. It’s not like I’ve seen them at family functions, you know. But I saw them in the hospital and they look so concerned for me. Which I know they love me. But you know, we’re not close. [Jared: Mmhmm.] But then when they walked out, I saw my dad as a brother. [Jared: Mmhmm.] And I was like, Oh, they’re not here for me. They’re here for him. Here’s this whole other relationship that these people have versus like, my father, my uncles.They’re brothers who are trying to support them in kind of what’s happening here. And so, as your mom is kind of falling into her instincts in these other roles, what was your instinct when you hear this? How did that even land on you?

Jared: Yeah, hearing that, and being 2000 plus miles away, I felt completely, like, helpless and hopeless, all at the same time. We’re in the middle of the pandemic. Still very beginning, I still don’t understand how this is working. I definitely don’t feel comfortable flying. But I do want to be home. Seattle’s a hotspot at the time. I’m kind of feeling like, What can I do? Or what should I do? And my uncle who I’m close with reached out to me asking, you know, “We’re here for you. Please, please let us know if there’s anything that you need. We’ll come and pick you up from the airport.” [Jodi-Ann: Mmm.] And it was just, it was said like that.

Jodi-Ann: Like this assumption that you were going to be there. Yeah.

Jared: Exactly, exactly. I remember feeling instantly guilty. And I don’t think that they meant it in that way at all. I do think that they were saying it to like, “We will do anything for you. And we will come pick you up.” But I remember reading that and feeling like shit. Am I supposed to be going home? And then I felt very guilty about that, and I didn’t know what to do. 

And again, we’re, I’m stuck in Seattle. Literally. I’ve been in my apartment since March 3rd. Hadn’t seen anyone other than my partner and my dog. Now I’m expected to be home? I didn’t know what to think about or what to do with it, or if I should buy a flight home, but I definitely did not feel safe doing so. And I later did talk to my mom about it. And I had asked like, “Am I expected to be a home? Like, should I come home?” And we had all agreed, in my immediate family, so my mom and my sisters, that it would be best if I stayed in Seattle, because at this point, we didn’t really know what was going on. 

You We just knew that my dad had a grapefruit in his head. Not a not a literal one. But we knew that he was in the hospital alone and had this grapefruit in his head. And we decided together that you know, it doesn’t make sense for you to come home. We don’t know what it’s like to travel right now. I think it’s best for you to also stay in Seattle, and be safe, and everyone else involved. [Jodi-Ann: Yeah.] So that’s what we decided. But I do remember that day feeling, when I did get that message, very lost. And then I did kind of feel a little bit hurt and lost that I wasn’t getting these direct messages again from my mom. Not that getting them from my sisters wasn’t good enough. And it was. But I do have to remember the position that my mom was in, and everything that she had to manage. But I know that she was thinking of me the entire time. [Jodi-Ann: Yeah.] But there was definitely this aspect of feeling helpless and hopeless and wishing that I was in Michigan, that I could just drive across the Michigan border and-and up in Toledo and not having to feel guilty for being so far away. I think that was like, the very first time where I felt very guilty for moving to Seattle. 

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. So in the context of like, all the shittiness of 2020, [Jared: chuckles] you have this incredible, bright spot, right? With your engagement. And [Jared: Yeah.] y’all are just so cute, [Jared: *laughs*] I will-I will say for the listeners, Jared is-was not my, he’s a secondary friend. Ryan was the person I knew. And then now I love you both equally. [Jared: *laughs*] I love – Jared, you and I can stand the sun a little bit more. So I think we have a closer bond than Ryan.

Jared: No shade.

Jodi-Ann: No, no, exactly. No. Shade. *both laugh*

Jared: Oh, my God, I did not even mean it that way. Literally, no shade.

Jodi-Ann: Lit-er-ally, no shade. Okay, so how did you decide to tell them?

Jared: I think during the-the moment in time, like, it was still the pandemic, I felt kind of weird sharing that news to the world. Because, again, it’s a pandemic, and–

Jodi-Ann: Nobody should be happy right now. *both laugh*

Jared: Everyone needs to be sad. [Jodi-Ann: Exactly.] I didn’t know how to make of the news. Like it was very exciting to be in and to live on that and share that with friends. But I didn’t want to make it about myself or us. Like I wanted to kind of keep that to ourselves. But then, internalized guilt kind of comes along. And it kind of parallels how I felt when I was coming out to my parents. 

Jodi-Ann: Mmm.

Jared:  I had spent– like, I knew in undergrad that I was gay and was having this like separate life. And I hate having to say it that way. But I had my life at college, and then how people thought of me when I went home. And time caught up. And I was feeling guilty. And mainly because I felt like I was lying to my family, my parents. And you know, they’re my, they’re my family, I love them. I want to be honest with them. And I want them in on where I’m at in my life. And so it was the exact same feeling where significant time had passed. And I was starting to feel guilty for not letting them know, but I didn’t want them to find out another method or another avenue. Again, very similar to coming out to them seven years ago as a 20-year-old undergrad.

Jodi-Ann: Now they have Snapchat. 

Jared:  Now they have Snapchat. *laughs

Jodi-Ann: They could have seen it somehow. *laughs*

Jared: Thankfully, I don’t post that kind of stuff on Snapchat. *laughs*

Jodi-Ann: Okay.

Jared: So, that’s when I decided to make the decision to tell them because, again, I don’t want to lie and I don’t want to feel like I’m lying. And this should be something that’s happy, right? It’s-even though it’s the middle of the pandemic, I want to feel happy and I want my family to be on this because they’re important and I want them to be in our lives and to celebrate it. Right?

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. 

Jared: And then that was met with a very different response.

Jodi-Ann: Yeah so, let’s pick it up there, right, like– so, you tell your parents. We know how they responded. And then you have this follow up conversation with your dad.

Jared: Mmhmm. 

Jodi-Ann: What happened? 

Jared: If you’re following along and keeping up with this, like, muddy story, we’re now back in the Pop Tarts weekend, right? 

Jodi-Ann: Okay, great. 

Jared: And I am, this is where I’m talking to my dad, literally two or three minutes in the conversation again, to recap, it goes for a turning point. And that’s when my dad springs on me. “Well, as you know, the information that you threw at me last week, really threw me for a loop.”

And I didn’t say anything. And I had to process what he was saying. What I’m hearing and thinking, Did he just say what I think he said, that he-and the tone of his voice was piercing. Where’s this conversation going to go? And why is this being brought up now? 

So, at this point, as I’m on the phone call and talking to my dad, about why was he at Lowe’s and how was he doing in the hospital room being alone, because he’s at a hospital that’s for non-COVID patients. And they’re being very strict of who can be in there. And I’m also feeling slightly guilty that I can’t even be there with my dad and he’s alone in this room. Then he throws a wrench into this conversation of the news that I shared with him last week threw him for a loop. 

Well, I’m thinking, Well, why did it throw you for a loop? And why are you coming across as upset and the tone of your voice is very piercing. And my dad starts to explain, “I wasn’t expecting that. And, you know, this is not what your mom and I like, raised you or believe in.” And “I haven’t been very preachy,” is what he said too, “in the past couple of years.” My dad always has to, for some reason, feel like he needs to preach to my sisters and I. That’s another story that has nothing to do with this. [Jodi-Ann: *laughs*]

But I’m like, What do you need to be preachy about? And I’m not saying anything, I’m just letting my dad talk. So everything that I’m saying, right now, were just internalized thoughts. [Jodi-Ann: Yeah.] And my dad is like, “You know, we haven’t talked with you about this,” or “this isn’t what-we, what we preach. And I haven’t gotten preachy with you lately. And maybe I should have been, but you’re going to kill your mom with a heartbreak.”

And I know that I said that a little bit aggressively right now. But that’s the way that it came off. And I’m being very generous in the way that I’m coming-or saying it. It was so piercing, saying that. It felt like my dad had stabbed me, in my heart, and in my back 1,000 times in the millisecond. What do you mean that mom is going to die of a heart attack? And then he brings in, “you know, Dr. Oz says that you can die of a heart attack.” [Jodi-Ann: *laughing*] Like, Dr. Oz, like why are you listening to Dr. Oz. Like, and What does he have to do with anything of this? And he was like, “You know, we-we love you. We love you and Ryan, we enjoy Ryan.” And to keep everyone and you-like, they visited us, they visited us multiple times in Ann Arbor, Michigan.

Jodi-Ann: Like, he’s not a secret. [Jared: Exactly.] He’s been a part of your family [Jared: Right?] gatherings.

Jared:  They visited us for the first time in Seattle a year ago in October. And so I’m still sitting there with nothing to say, very shocked. And then he throws at me. After he says, “you know, we love you and Ryan, but we think you’re confused.” 

Jodi-Ann: Mm-mm.

Jared:  And it just felt like he was just digging that knife in deeper and deeper. And I’m like confused about what? I know what he meant. But about what? And why are you confused? And why is mom feeling heartbroken around this because to me, that sounds really selfish. And you didn’t even say congratulations or that you’re happy for me or for us. 

And I’m just sitting there saying, “Mmhmm”, in the kitchen of my apartment, my Pop Tart ingredients behind me, [Jodi-Ann: chuckles] because I hadn’t made them. Then my dad starts to bring in you know, “I just hope you find your way back to Jesus.” And his voice starts to crack at this point. 

I grew up in a very spiritual household. I grew up going to church twice a week, mission trips. I was one of those kids. That’s just how we were raised and brought up. And there’s nothing wrong with how my parents live their lives and what they believe in. And I appreciate the way that they raised me because that’s how I treat other people and the values that I have in my own life. And just hearing that I was like, What do you mean, make my way back? Who is here to judge my relationship with God? But now, why are you judging that type of relationship? But I guess I’ve also have never told my parents like, just because I’m gay doesn’t mean that I’ve forgotten about my faith. You know, I still believe in God or a higher being. Yes, I don’t practice it like they do. But I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. 

And then the conversation just, I felt like was getting worse. And I’m still sitting there like, okay, okay. And then my dad is like, you know, “We miss you terribly.” And my dad is not one to cry. And so hearing him, his voice crack on the phone, I’m starting to feel a little bit uncomfortable. And I’m like, What do I do? And so I finally was able to say, you know, “I miss you, too. I miss you a lot.” And then that’s when the phone call ends. 

And I remember just sitting-sitting in my kitchen thinking, What just happened? Here I’m trying to figure out like, what’s going on with my dad, and why he’s in the hospital. And then he throws this at me. And I tell my, my partner, like, they’d asked, like-like, why were we engaged and that he was upset by it and to come back to Jesus. And I remember Ryan laughed, and he was like, ”are you…are you serious? Like, that’s how, that’s how he would respond?”

And in my time, I lashed out, and I definitely shouldn’t have lashed out. But I remember thinking like, This is my dad, like he could be on his deathbed. Like, I literally have no idea. And why would you laugh?

We laugh about it now. Because looking back on it, like, why would my dad have this conversation? Because we at this point, we still didn’t know. 

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. 

Jared:  What this–

Jodi-Ann What his situation was.

Jared:  Yeah, exactly. And so I just remember coming across-coming away from that conversation and feeling very, very lost and really hurt and super confused. On top of this pandemic world and getting engaged and telling them the weekend before, and now he’s in a hospital, which we still don’t know what it is at this point. He throws this loop and he pulls in this other aspect of my identity into the story, and I’m just at a loss, and I have no idea what to do. And I just kind of shut down. 

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. 

Jared:  And…kind of left it at that.

*pause*

Jodi-Ann: *heavy sigh* So when did you learn that he had cancer?

Jared:  So at this point, his surgery was scheduled for the following Tuesday. And honestly, the anxiety around like, what is it, like, I just want to know, was so hard to manage. Pretty much every hour I was on FaceTime calls with my sisters and my mom, because they’re all with each other in my-in my sister’s apartment. Then later on Tuesday, surgery goes successful. It goes well. My mom is able to see him. And then I remember having a conversation with some folks of like, everything came back fine. Like they don’t think it’s cancer. 

Jodi-Ann: I remember that. 

Jared: Like, Yay! Rejoice! This is happy news, no cancer! And then not even 24 hours later, I get a call from my sister. I wasn’t up yet for work. And so I get out of bed and I call my sister back—my younger sister back—and then that’s when she tells me that the diagnosis and the test results came back cancerous. I remember hearing her voice shake and hearing that thinking, okay. And if you know me, you know *chuckles* that I-I don’t respond to news, like, immediately, I take time to process it. And I remember sitting on the couch, feeling that exact same way of hearing like, Okay, tell me a little bit more. And so then she starts to tell me and her voice is shaky. And she starts to tell me that it’s called glioblastoma—GBM for short. They had described it as a rare, aggressive brain cancer, and the survivability is not great. And I just remember hearing that, Okay, well, what’s the survivability and I remember her telling me, “They are predicting 12 to 18 months.”I remember just kind of hearing like okay, it’s still not really settling in and we weren’t on the phone for long and so I said, you know, like, “Hang in there. Stay strong.” Like, “Call us if you need anything” and I hung up the phone. And I walked back to the bedroom. And Ryan had asked me like, if everything was okay. And I told him exactly what my younger sister had told me. And we talked about it and 15 minutes go by, it’s still nothing. Like I’m still just sitting there. And then out of nowhere, just waterworks come out of nowhere, and I literally cannot catch my breath. And at this point, I’m still expected to be at work in 15 minutes. I’m working remotely because again, pandemic. And so at this point, I had already kept up with my-my manager, like, what had you been going on, and keeping them in the loop. 

Jared: And so I finally call and I, like, just stay strong and just stay strong. I remember calling her and saying “it came back cancerous”, and I couldn’t even like get it out before just like, bursting into tears. And I look and like, I can still hear myself being like, “they, they’re expecting it to survive-survivability 12 to 18 months”, and I’m like, trying to catch my breath. It’s like “12 to *breathing rapidly* 18 months”, like it’s coming out just like that. And she’s just like, “it’s okay. Like take your time”. And she let me take the day off. And I had actually worked the day that my dad was going through surgery, because I needed to kind of keep my mind on something else. But I was also trying to remain positive, like, Oh, it’s nothing. And just my world had just completely shattered that-that day, and it’s all a very big blur, but it all happened so fast. Like, Saturday, my dad falls in Lowe’s. We’re waiting, we’re waiting, we’re getting some results here and there, we learn that he isn’t retaining short term memory. So the way–the things that he’s saying—his personality, his personality definitely did change and seemed very-very out of the ordinary. So that news, just all of it was just so overwhelming. Fast forward to Tuesday surgery. We’re good. Yay, it’s out. They believe they got all of the tumor. significant time rolls around. Yay, we don’t think it’s cancer. I share that news with some folks, I share that with you, we rejoice, hallelujah. Not even 24 minute-24 hours rolls around, and my world just completely shatters. And that all happened in a span of less than five days.

Jodi-Ann: *Exhales* You know, many times on this podcast, for those who survived cancer, or for those who have lost their loved ones to cancer, we still talk about-about it in the present tense because there’s this feeling that cancer is always with you. The fear of cancer in our bodies stays with us for people who have survived, okay, when is it going to come again? Or [Jared: Mmhmm], you know, the changes that we have in our body as a result of the treatment, or the love that we still have for the people that we lost, you know, that stays with us. Everything is-feels very present and we treat it as something present. [Jared: Mmhmm] But in your case, you are literally going through it right now. Like this is your life right now. [Jared: Yeah.] Your father is battling cancer right now.

Jared: On top of everything else [Jodi-Ann: on top of everything else], it’s like the cherry—2020’s like, “here you go.”

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. Just Oh, you thought it was bad? *chuckles* Like…

Jared: Exactly. That’s how it feels. 

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. How do you manage that every day, like, managing your own fears and concerns and managing what you know or what you don’t know about your dad’s case and managing how you show up for your family? How do you be in Jared’s body right now?

Jared: I will say it’s hard to manage sometimes. And it can be a little difficult. And it was really hard for me shortly after the diagnosis, trying to kind of piece my world back together on how I thought I wanted it to be but I knew it was not at all where I wanted it to be. And this is not what I expected it to be. And it was really hard to manage. A significant time has passed now. We’re now nearing almost six months that we’ve learned of this and which is a lot of time like six months is a lot of time and each day does grow to be a little bit easier. But there still is this lingering thought, just like internal battles of like, how do I actually manage it. And you know, when I first heard of the diagnosis, I felt like my family bond was so strong and the time that I wasn’t at work because I took a week off. Like I was on phone calls with them every moment of the day, like, I would say, every 30 minutes. Like if we hung up a phone call, 30 minutes later, we were on another one hung up 30 minutes later on another. And I felt like that made our bond so strong. And I learned a lot of how we are going to tackle this as a family and move forward. 

But it-it’s become—it’s become really difficult to begin to like, where do I even go outside of my family? Who can I talk to, because it’s hard to find people that are in that same exact situation as well, too. But then I’m also trying to comfort myself and not think that just because you have cancer, it’s the end all be all. And I think there’s a common misconception that cancer equals death. And I don’t want to ever have this thought that cancer equals that because that’s not always the case, because it is different for every person, but I don’t want to create this, or even think of cancer and this like negative light, or this stigma that they’re going to die from cancer. 

So having to manage all of that, on top of a pandemic, and expected to be doing like working remotely, and then being engaged, which should be happy, because we were still a newly engaged couple at that time. And there were some times where I did shut down, and how I would manage it was just kind of being with myself. And I can go hours, I’m totally comfortable going hours just with my own thoughts, and not a good habit to have. And it’s carried from my childhood into my adult life. But I’ve become so good at being able to turn my emotions on and off with the switch, when they’re on, they’re on full force, and they’re coming out of the floodgates with no control. [Jodi-Ann: *chuckles*] And it was like growing up for most of my life. And I’ve been able to manage that through therapy, but I still have tendencies where I’m like, you know, I can turn this off, and I can focus on some other thing. And friends and family and even my partner Ryan will look at me saying like, “Are you okay?”, like, and they’ll try to get me to talk about it. I’m like, everything’s fine. Like, they just don’t understand like, no, everything’s not fine. Like, I know you’re thinking about something deep down and having to manage that has become difficult, but it’s become easier over time. But I know that when it first started, I was definitely channeling my energy into work, or just talking to people, my friends through phone calls, or diving deep into playing video games for hours, which I hadn’t played video games for years. And it was a good outlet for me. But I know that deep down, I wasn’t addressing what’s going on. 

Now that we’re almost six months later, I really have managed it a lot better. And I try to talk about it openly. I still don’t—I’m still a little bit vulnerable and protective of a bit of it. But I do think that talking about it in this podcast is healing for me. And it allows me to actually verbally talk about it, because you and I have had separate conversations and you know, and only some other folks know that I talk about it in a very, very limited capacity. And I think what’s also helped me is that, even though there’s this thought of Can I be upset with my family, i.e. my parents, Can I even be upset with my dad for things that he said when he’s struggling with cancer? But I know deep down that I don’t want—if this is the end road that I still want to live these days with my dad being joyful and being happy. I don’t want to remember back on these days thinking it was miserable or just constantly living in fear of what’s going to happen next. So you know, it’s just the way that my parents taught me that it’s not always about myself and I’ve never wanted to make it about myself even though my partner Ryan was like “You should tell them what’s going on,” but I was like I don’t want to make it about myself. It’s about my dad. 

Jodi-Ann: Yeah.

Jared:  And that was really hard to manage. And oh, [Jodi-Ann: Yeah.] it’s been a lot. And I guess kind of just because of my nature, I reach out to my mom and dad weekly because I want them to know that I’m here for them. Because I’m 2,000 miles away. And I want my dad to know [Jodi-Ann: Yeah] that I’m here for him even though there are things that have been said that are irreversible, but I still don’t even know if he knows that he said these things to me. It’s hard to manage.

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. So it’s like, as you’re saying, as part of his condition, he can lose his short term memory, his personality changes. And then he has this really triggering and traumatizing reaction to this incredible news that you are going to marry the person that you love. I also love him, but obviously... [Jared laughs] So you know, so there’s this question like, does he remember saying what he said? Or did he mean it? [Jared: Exactly.] And so what do you think that you would risk by asking him about it? Because it hasn’t come up since right? Like y’all haven’t talked about it.

Jared: No, it hasn’t come up since. And I think that even that goes back to the question of like, how do I manage it? And I’ll be truthfully honest, like, yes, I learned how to manage it better. But there are still days where I don’t, and I don’t know—have the answers. And I don’t know who to contact. And when you look online, you get all these scary side stories and like probabilities of what could happen in the survivability and it just you go into this deep rabbit hole, and you get really sad. And then I think about like, Well, can I bring this up with my dad? Can I talk about it, but then I guess what I think about what I am going to risk is the feeling of what it was like when it came out to them seven plus years ago. That was a really big turning point in my life, to come out to my parents who are Christians, and I grew up in that Christian household, and I know where they stand on it. I’ve heard how my parents have talked about homosexuality growing up and how the church has talked about it or family members. 

And I guess what I’m really risking is that feeling of what it was like, as a 19-20 year old college student, and I guess selfishly, I don’t want to go through that again, because I felt like we were at a place where they were accepting of me and my partner, and they were a part of that life. And I was with—I’ve been with him for five plus years. And I just feel like I don’t want to go through that hurt and pain all over again. 

But a part of me doesn’t even want to know, did my dad truly mean it? Because I don’t even know how I would react. If my dad said yes, but then there’s this other moving part of the story where we did learn that at that time, he wasn’t retaining any short term memory. So does he even remember? So I have to ask myself that question constantly. Do I have the courage? Am I ready to know that? And what if my dad doesn’t know? And we’ve talked about it before? And I’ve talked about it with my partner, well, what do I have to risk? Like? What if this is the answer? Do you want to know? And then am I going to be okay with not knowing? 

Part of me, because of the unhealthy habits that I’ve created, where I can turn things on and off. Sometimes I tell myself, like, yeah, I think I would be okay, not knowing. But then other times where I’m like, are you sure about that? And to be truthfully honest, I still don’t have the answer of like, what am I going to risk? But I think it does come down to the fact of do I want to say those words out loud to my dad? Do you remember saying this to me? And did you mean that? Because if he says yes, I do remember? And yes, I do mean that? That adds a whole other layer to this story. And basically I go back seven years, and I don’t want to do that. Because I felt like we were at a place. So now I feel like, was everything that my parents were doing…was it just a false hope? Was it just a facade? I really don’t know. But why would you do that? Why would you hang out with us? Why would you just assume that after five years this wouldn’t happen? 

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. I mean, I think it’s important to validate and affirm that it is okay to be in a place where you don’t know. [Jared: Mmhmm.] And what makes this more complex is we also don’t know what’s going to happen to your dad. [Jared: Exactly.] And so ultimately, the question is, can you be mad at somebody who’s battling cancer?

Jared: Mmhmm. What at first happened hearing that all within that five day span. And it wasn’t until a few weeks later that I did openly admit to my best friend and Ryan, that I’m upset, I’m hurt. And I’m angry at my dad and my mom. But I didn’t want to put it out and open it into the universe, because I didn’t know. How is that gonna come back to me? 

And I’m not allowed to feel that way. I still didn’t know. But I remember saying it for the first time. But even then, even though I’ve said it, like, Am I still allowed to be upset at him? And even though I felt that way, and I didn’t acknowledge it until many weeks later, I was still consistently reaching out to my mom and my dad, specifically my dad, to see how he was doing because again, I don’t want to make this about me. And I keep telling my best friends and Ryan and you that it’s not about me, it’s about my dad. And then that whole question of like, can I even be mad at him, flies out the window. But it does pop up from time to time. And, again, it’s one of those things where like, I don’t even have the answer of, am I allowed to be mad?

Jodi-Ann: And I think it’s okay to leave that question unanswered. Like, the question itself, sometimes is the answer of the thing that you keep revisiting. It’s just a part of your story. And, you know, what I think is really important to me about this podcast is to disrupt this idea that the cancer journey only belongs to the person who has the diagnosis. This, this story, the conversation that you and I are having, and your experience is your journey. That is your cancer story. And I think oftentimes, when cancer enters our lives, you know, and rightfully so, sometimes the rest of our lives gets de-prioritized, right? *chuckles* [Jared: Mhmm.] But our lives are still happening. And so I think it’s so powerful and really important to put in conversation, like, understanding your identity, understanding this incredible milestone that you’re reaching with your partner. And it’s happening, and COVID. And your father has a really scary diagnosis. And… and it’s all kind of fucked up. *chuckles* [Jared: It is!] Right? Like, it’s just fucked up.

Jared: It is. It is. 

Jodi-Ann: It’s so fucked! I don’t know how else to say it. 

Jared: That’s really the way to put it. I didn’t know, like, if I should say it that way. But then I also think about it constantly on the reg of Well, does my experience even matter? Because everyone’s going through a really shitty year. Does-  my are my feelings validated? I know that I, I possibly can’t be the only one that’s going through this on top of the pandemic. And then I have this other thing. We’re getting engaged, like it’s all intersectional. And then I just kind of think to myself, Well, I’m not any, I’m not anything special. Everyone’s going through a hard year, so just toss it behind you and keep on going. Like, Yeah, you’re fucked. And just keep on going. That’s been my mode of operation, too.

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. I mean, I guess that’s one way to compartmentalize it. Like when I got my diagnosis, it was hella scary. And I got it as a single person living in Seattle without family here and trying to manage everything and what have you. And I just remember settling on, This is so fucked. And [Jared: Yeah.] I felt so bad. I just felt targeted by the universe in some way. Just like, Why me? Me! The most active person in my life is the one who’s being threatened with paralysis. And then I just settled on, like, Everyone goes through a shitty thing. And instead of, like, erasing myself, I centered it right. [Jared: Mhmm.] It’s just like, this is my this is my shitty thing. [Jared: Yeah.] Everybody has a shitty thing. This is my shitty thing. Right? And so like, yeah. [Jared: Mhmm.] Everyone’s having – most people like we said, there’s some people out here building houses and shit. [Jared laughs] But most people are having a really, really terrible 2020. And this is what your terrible 2020 looks like with these nuances. But then layered on to like, “I’m getting married y’all! Woop woop!” You know?

Jared: Yeah. *laughs*

Jodi-Ann: Yeah, I mean, just, it’s a lot, a lot of different parts of your life are, are coming together, you know, at this intersection right now. And so, I know in a lot of ways that in doing this podcast, it’s healing for you, and a way for maybe other people to find you. And, you know, who knows what type of connections and community can come for this. But [Jared: Mhmm.] you know, what do you think that you want to share with other people who might be dealing with a loved one’s new cancer diagnosis, that it might also be intersecting with other parts of their identity right now. [Jared: Mhmm.]

Jared: I would want other folks to know, and especially if I would have known this shortly after my dad’s diagnosis, that there are other people out there, whether you know it or not. Yes, you might find some chat forums online that are like one to two plus years old. But that doesn’t make you feel comforted. Because it’s in the past, like those people were having those conversations online, years prior, and you’re just trying to search for answers. I would want folks to know that other people are out here, including myself, and whoever you are, whoever is listening, that I am here, and I’m also going through that as well. And part of understanding of who I am, is that I do crave human connection. And that’s something that we’re really missing right now, given the state of the world, given the pandemic of coronavirus that that’s kind of been stricken away from everyone this year. And it’s really hard to manage that. But there’s ways that we can go about connecting to not only heal individually, but together. 

That’s what I would really want folks to know is that not only is there other people out there, but I’m here as well, too. And I can’t say for certain that our stories would be the same or our experiences with cancer would be the same, but that one connection of going through it in this given state, because it intersects with each other, that’s what I would probably focus on. And I’m here, I’m a lending ear, I would say some of the strongest connections come from people that you didn’t know, and they flourish into something new. But also find time again, like you were saying, to make it your own, like reclaim it as your story. Like, don’t make it this foreign thing that’s so different, or like out of this world like it’s yours. And it’s okay to grieve. It’s okay to feel the way that you feel. But don’t make it feel like it’s not important or it doesn’t matter. And don’t downplay it, because that’s what I did at the very beginning, because I didn’t know what to do. But just find those moments where you, again, reclaim it. Find inner peace with yourself. Find moments that are going to bring you joy, but also really search for human connection in this world where it’s going to have to be done all digitally. But [Jodi-Ann: Yeah.] that’s really kind of like the takeaway. 

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. And so speaking of human connection, your fiance who you love and adore, y’all have been spending a lot of time together. *both laugh*

Jared: Y’all 

Jodi-Ann: More than one would expect. *laughs*

Jared: I’ve had to create some boundaries between the hours of five and seven. It is, “don’t talk to me and do whatever you want to do. It’s your time. But between the hours of five and 7pm I don’t know you”. [Jodi-Ann: Yeah. *laughs*] I don’t know who she is. Leave me alone.

Jodi-Ann: So I can imagine, like, for folks who are out there who are having a really tough time. They might be living with people. They’re just watching the people that they love, have a really tough time. And so what advice or what would you want to share with them for how they could approach the person in their life that they love that is dealing with something similar to you?

Jared: Well I won’t sugarcoat it, it is, it’s hard and it’s difficult to manage. There’s been tension between my partner and I just given there’s so many different moving parts. Again, because it is centered around the cancer diagnosis. Like that’s how all these different levels come in. But as we go through it, I think, like I’ve had to become vulnerable, whether I liked it or not. But I know that there is power in vulnerability. That what’s helped us, even though I know that he has so many pending questions, and he wants to talk about it more than I do, but just giving your current state of where you’re at, and communicating that with your partner, or whoever you’re living with, where you’re at is going to go a long way. Because without telling them that it is going to drive them crazy. Because they don’t like to see someone that they love going through this, it’s-it’s hurtful for them as well, too. Because they also feel like they can’t do anything. 

And they feel helpless. And that’s been communicated to me by my partner, for Ryan has said, like, “I don’t know how to meet your needs, I don’t know what to do”. And in some capacity, you know, he actually has gone through this before. His grandfather had GBM. But again, a very different age, demographic, and it happened so many years ago that and it wasn’t during a pandemic, like it’s a very different experience. And it does have to come down to just being vulnerable, and there is power and vulnerability, telling them, “This is what I where I’m at right now. Here’s how much I can talk about it, here’s my mental capacity. But we can circle and come back to this at a later time.” Because if they don’t hear those words, it is going to cause tension. And they’re just going to feel even more helpless of how can they even help someone that they know is hurting?

Jodi-Ann: I’m sure people have their instincts of like, “how can I support this person?” So I think hearing your perspective of, “Okay, here’s how you can support someone like me” is, is so important. And that’s going to involve some really tough conversations. And that might involve you being a little isolated from this process. And it is a process, and so maybe how we show up in the beginning for each other will change, you know, over time. And just being present I think is so important. [Jared: Mhmm.] So thank you for being present with me, and-and sharing your story. And not just for this podcast. But trusting me with this when things were going on earlier in the summer. And as things progress, and like, I think about you all the time, and I know you just have so many unanswered questions and so many things that you have to decide, and-and how you reconcile and how you manage everything. And so I’m here for you, I think the larger community is here for you. And the answers to those questions can maybe only get revealed over time. [Jared: Mhmm.]

Jared: And I just have to thank you for being you, and my friend, and just always offering a lending ear with your love and support whether it’s virtually or social distance paddling. But it does mean the world to me, because, and I think what you just mentioned right there was present. It’s so hard to find stories in the present because it goes back to either it was past tense, where it either happened to myself or someone that I loved. But just having you here with me, along with my partner Ryan, it truly means the world to not only him but to me as well. 

Jodi-Ann: Yeah. And plus we’re-we’re forever bonded, Jared. [Jared: We are.] My-my dog is in love with you. *laughs*

Jared: Oh Bilsky! I love him too. I’m still so shocked that he knows who Ryan and I are. And I’m not upset about that. [Jodi-Ann: He’s so excited every time he sees you.] Bilsky, I will always be your “guncle” and he better not forget it.

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Jodi-Ann: Black cancer was created, edited, and produced by me, Jodi-Ann Burey. Thank you so much, Jared, for sharing your story with us to make sure that other Black cancer stories become center to how we talk about cancer. Rate. Subscribe. Take a few minutes to just leave a review where you find your podcasts. Find us at blackcancer.co and on Instagram @_black_cancer. Trauma comes with endless wisdom for ourselves and those around us. Tell someone you know about Black cancer.

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Jodi-Ann: Hi, everyone, Jodi-Ann here. This is our last episode for season one. And I just wanted to thank you so much for listening and supporting these stories as we launched this first season. Sharing eight stories from eight different people of color who have all experienced cancer and their lives in some way has, I don’t know how to put it, but I think it’s put me on the path to become a different person than I was when I started this project. So I really want to thank every single guest we had on this season: Shayla, Yejin, Juliette, Sharon, Erika, Erin, Frantz and Jared, your stories matter to me. Your stories matter. Your lives matter. This project matters. So share this wide and far, you don’t know who it might find. It might just find them exactly when they need it. Reach out to me at hello@blackcancer.co for any and all inquiries, to share your story next season, press, to share your ideas and feedback. Leave a review on whatever platform you use to find your podcasts, and we’ll see you in the new year. Be safe everyone.